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Gretzky Overtime Players vs. Stiga Players

 
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BlackHawkFan
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 4:49 pm    Post subject: Gretzky Overtime Players vs. Stiga Players Reply with quote

This is my first time posting on this awesome forum and I had a question for the resident experts on here:

Are the Gretzky players significantly larger than the Stiga? I just purchased some Stiga players for the purposes of modifying an existing game that has 2D players, but they are too small (around 2.5" Height and Length) for the size of the game.

Some sellers on ebay are offering the Gretzky Overtime players. They are 3D and appear to be bigger and longer than the Stiga. I need the reach from center of the player pin attachment to the rod to the outer edge of the stick to be around 3" in length (Stiga is only 1.75")

Can someone please confirm the size (height, width/reach) of the existing Gretzky players?

Thanks,
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bramabull38
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Gretzky players have a length of 2 - 3/8" length from center of hole to the edge of the stick.
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BlackHawkFan
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bramabull38 wrote:
The Gretzky players have a length of 2 - 3/8" length from center of hole to the edge of the stick.

Thanks Bram!

I went ahead and ordered the 50th Anniversary ed. of the Stiga game, and will end up talking with Rick Benej about developing some 3D players for his existing Classic game. Another possibility is to go with the smaller 30" x 60" (less expensive alternative) game from Lyle Knittig's SFR outfit in Canada. I really like the way his games look.

Has anyone here played that enormous 4 x 7 foot game by Artizan? It looks like a solid table, though I am in agreement with a few others on this forum that the players look a little like aliens. I actually like the swipe away mechanism of theirs from behind the net, mimicking a goalie clearing the puck from behind the net. No other custom design or manufacturer has come up with a realistic way for the goalie to go get caught behind the net, which happens a lot in hockey.

Cheers!
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Paul
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlackHawkFan wrote:
No other custom design or manufacturer has come up with a realistic way for the goalie to go get caught behind the net, which happens a lot in hockey.

Actually there is a game that does this very well, but it's not manufactured anymore (see below).

~Paul

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BlackHawkFan
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul,

That is a nice-looking game! I figured it would be a simple design to allow the goalie to go behind the net to retrieve pucks, but as your photo shows, it can only accommodate the goalie being able to do it on one side of the net, otherwise the goalie crease and net would fall through the game!

I am definitely looking into "realizing" my idea of the "perfect" table hockey game. I like the way the Stiga plays (gears, 3D players, winger behind the net play), I love the way the Rick Benej table looks and allows for smooth passing, and I really like the size of the games from Artizan and Sports For Real.

I DO believe that you can combine the best aspects of each of these "different" designs into an aesthetically-pleasing game, that allows for total player control yet has a large playing surface, and moreover, holds up to aggressive play like a Chexx dome game, but is significantly less expensive than either that game or the one from Artizan.

If someone wants to build me this game.....let's talk!

Cheers,
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Paul
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlackHawkFan wrote:
Paul, I DO believe that you can combine the best aspects of each of these "different" designs into an aesthetically-pleasing game, that allows for total player control yet has a large playing surface, and moreover, holds up to aggressive play like a Chexx dome game, but is significantly less expensive than either that game or the one from Artizan.

If someone wants to build me this game.....let's talk

Sure it can be significant cheaper,...if you build it yourself. Smile Remember the old saying, "you get what you pay for" usually that's the case.

~Paul
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BlackHawkFan
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul,

No doubt, the amount of care and detail that goes into some of these custom-made games warrants a high price tag, and deservedly so.

But there is a huge disparity between some of these "custom-made" games currently sold on the market, and we're talking thousands of dollars, not just hundreds. If I had a little more money, I would buy one of Lyle Knittig's awesome games from him, and no doubt it would be worth every penny, I'm certain.

I'm really referring more to an alternative to the Stiga game, than I am to a labor of love sold by designers north of the border.

Some of the mass-produced games like Halex and Carrum sell for around $400 online, and these games feature foosball-like tables, 3D players, time clocks, automatic puck returns, etc. Even if you doubled the size of the playing surface, thereby doubling the price to produce it, they can still get away with selling it for $800-$1,000 to the hockey connoisseur, for 1/3rd the price of the Chexx game, which caters more to the video arcade crowd.

I, for one, have no need for fancy score towers, ornate legs or special sound effects. Just give me a game that is large, and plays realistically in the $1,000 range, and I'm sold.

That type of game can absolutely be mass-produced, and would be an affordable alternative to say a game like the Artizan, which sells for over $5,500, and that's without shipping costs. That game certainly does not cater to the blue-collar table hockey fan, which represents the majority of table hockey fandom.

This is the main reason why Stiga is the "official" game for table hockey competition worldwide....even a teenager can afford it, and leagues can literally buy a dozen of them for tournament play without breaking in the wallet too much.

I just want to take the next "big" logical step up from my Coleco, Stiga and Rick Benej games.
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mariners_fever
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

having played both benej and lyle knittigs game, i can say that my preference is Lyle's SFR game. I just didn't feel a rhythm in the gameplay on the Benej like i felt playing Lyle's, and having had him also craft a custom team and suplaks for me, his craftsmanship is the best I have seen.

td
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Dar
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

whats the price on an SFR game?
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BlackHawkFan
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mariners_fever wrote:
having played both benej and lyle knittigs game, i can say that my preference is Lyle's SFR game. I just didn't feel a rhythm in the gameplay on the Benej like i felt playing Lyle's, and having had him also craft a custom team and suplaks for me, his craftsmanship is the best I have seen.

td

Lyle's games look outstanding, and I am certain if I were to pick one up from him, I would be quite pleased with it. There's just a more commanding feel to gear-driven games (especially with heavier 3D players) than with those that are spring driven, as great as Rick Benej's game is.

Like I said before, if you can marry the look of Benej's game, the power and control of a gear driven game like the Stiga, and something approaching the size of an Artizan table, you have an ideal mating....and that's what Lyle's game comes closest to achieving to my eyes.

I just wish he didn't live all the way out near Edmonton, Alberta.

Dar, you asked about the price of Lyle's games. You can check out his website at Sports For Real.
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Dar
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice games. Blazing Guns I would like to see a version where the players are about half the size though.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dar wrote:
Nice games. I would like to see a version where the players are about half the size though.

During my e-mail exchanges with Lyle, it seemed that he would be able to mold you smaller players as long as the player stick lengths were suitable for the table width that you purchased.

I had mentioned a similar concern to him in my previous e-mail. I, too, was wondering if he would be able to make a more proportionate-looking 4" player for his large (42 x 65) game.

Without a doubt, he makes the most "realistic" looking game, and other forum members' testimonies suggest that his games have great player control as well.

I hope to get my hands on one of them soon!
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sklump
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In a recent order from RMG, where I basically begged them for any internationals they had lying around, loose, in gutters or urinals, I got two Swedish players compatible with Stiga but:

* the skate area has no round footing; the peg goes straight into the boot
* the stick angle is different
* the (metal) stick is curved!

Both are lefties, just like Stiga internationals. The reach appears the same.

Any idea what game these might be from? Just curious.
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PC_Gone _Crazy
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sklump wrote:
In a recent order from RMG, where I basically begged them for any internationals they had lying around, loose, in gutters or urinals, I got two Swedish players compatible with Stiga but:

* the skate area has no round footing; the peg goes straight into the boot
* the stick angle is different
* the (metal) stick is curved!

Both are lefties, just like Stiga internationals. The reach appears the same.

Any idea what game these might be from? Just curious.


Wha? they still had those chinese copies left over???
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sklump
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chinese copies? Really? If so, please tell us a story! When were these made?

The forehand is wicked for centre-dekes, it cradles the puck effortlessly, but the backhand sucks overall. I prefer straight sticks.

There haven't been any sets of Internationals available in Canada for about six months, and there won't be again until at least September, so I called them and begged them for whatever singletons they could find. I'm running out of spares. Colour is unimportant since I paint them all anyway.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To all those requesting international figures: why don't you send a polite e-mail to the sole distributor of Stiga material in Canada?

Right now they don't help the development of the game here, but are there to fish your money from your wallets!

And they get their stuff from nowheresville, USA from what I've got to know!

But our canadian distributor wants to make some money, because he imports from the US, who imports from you know where, the land of the three crowns!

No wonder stiga haters would rather play with canadian games, using canadian materials (made in China)!

Steve, you must remember those mock-up chinese Stigas they produced since 1998, as the old swedish machinery from 1982 got bought by chinese? They were still selling in Toys'R'Us stores before RMG supplied them with newer stock from Stiga!
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